A sign from Atlas historyczny Rzeczypospolitej Polskiej by Aleksander Jabłonowski.

[Alex_Da]

Hi there!

I need help with the identification of the signs (outlined yellow on the image attached), that appear here and there on the map and look like a tent or building with a wisp of smoke coming out from its top. Does anyone know what does this kind of sign represents?

Thanks in advance.

Cheers, Alex

[Sedco Express]

 

11 godzin temu, Alex_Da napisał:

Thanks for the response! I see your point. Do you have any references, where such "dymarki" are shown on the map? I was trying to find the legend for the Atlas historyczny Rzeczypospolitej Polskiej but found nothing yet.

I do not have it, but on this map some names of the places are two words, for example "Rud: Byrkówka". "Rud" is an abbreviation of the Polish word "ruda" ore (mineral) - iron ore was mined there.

[ptasznik]

[Alex_Da]

To Ptasznik: thanks a lot! I have no doubt such facilities existed. At the same time, I'm still hoping to find a map legend, where this icon (or similar) is shown with a caption.

[Bartee]

Some additional information:

1. Aleksander Jabłonowski wrote his "Atlas..." on the basis of the earlier work of the general Wojciech Chrzanowski. The title of his, printed in Paris, work: "Karta dawnej Polski z przyległymi okolicami krajów sąsiednich".

2. Sample (to compare) of the map from your opening post - see link below

http://maps.mapywig.org/m/Polish_maps/series/300K_Chrzanowski_Karta_dawnej_Polski/Chrzanowski300K_35_Kijów_amwig.jpg

3. The legend for the map exists on the sheet no. V (5) - unfortunately it does not contain the symbol you are looking for - see link below:

http://maps.mapywig.org/m/Polish_maps/series/300K_Chrzanowski_Karta_dawnej_Polski/Chrzan_05_Polonga_kpbc.jpg

 

cheers

[Alex_Da]

44 minutes ago, Bartee said:

Some additional information:

1. Aleksander Jabłonowski wrote his "Atlas..." on the basis of the earlier work of the general Wojciech Chrzanowski. The title of his, printed in Paris, work: "Karta dawnej Polski z przyległymi okolicami krajów sąsiednich".

2. Sample (to compare) of the map from your opening post - see link below

http://maps.mapywig.org/m/Polish_maps/series/300K_Chrzanowski_Karta_dawnej_Polski/Chrzanowski300K_35_Kijów_amwig.jpg

3. The legend for the map exists on the sheet no. V (5) - unfortunately it does not contain the symbol you are looking for - see link below:

http://maps.mapywig.org/m/Polish_maps/series/300K_Chrzanowski_Karta_dawnej_Polski/Chrzan_05_Polonga_kpbc.jpg

 

cheers

To Bartee: Amazing! Thanks a lot for your help. I've just compared two fragments from these maps and they match perfectly! Including the symbol in question. I wonder why did the author skip it in the legend? I guess this should be something well-known. By the way, does the "Karta dawnej Polski z przyległymi okolicami krajów sąsiednich" cover the same time period (edge of the XVI–XVII cent.) as the "Atlas..." does?

[Bartee]

5 minutes ago, Alex_Da napisał:

I wonder why did the author skip it in the legend?

Probably cuz he made his map on the basis of the earlier version - typical approach.

6 minutes ago, Alex_Da napisał:

By the way, does the "Karta dawnej Polski z przyległymi okolicami krajów sąsiednich" cover the same time period (edge of the XVI–XVII cent.) as the "Atlas..." does?

IMHO: yes.

[Erih]

My proposition : Not only "dymarka", this can be also "wapiennik" or "smolarnia". "Wapiennik" is a place of production calcium for builders, "smolarnia" is a tal factory.

[Alex_Da]

ОК, maybe we may apply the exclusion method. This is neither wind nor water mill. This is not a tavern. I was thinking about a "folwark" but then rejected this idea as the number of such symbols on the map seems to be insufficient for this proposition. 
To Erih: Thanks! You just gave me another idea. If this symbol had multiple meanings, e.g., "dymarka", "wapiennik", "smolarnia" or any other mine or facility, no surprise it was not included in the map legend. Does it sound reasonable?

[ptasznik]

Czy ktoś może zapytać założyciela tematu o ewentualne występowanie tych znaczków na terenach bardziej na zachód ? Widoczne na mapie miasto MALIN to już trochę czasu poza RP i przekazów historycznych o ewentualnej gospodarce w rejonie jakoś nie za bardzo można się doszukać. U mnie ''inglisz'' to tak bardziej domyślnie.

[Alex_Da]

To Ptasznik:. Good question. Until 1971, a cast iron foundry (odlewnia żeliwa) worked in Malyn. So, technically, the iron mines could have been around the city. I'll try to find more information.

[Lupus]

"wapiennik" needs limestone (google translation ). I don't think there are any deposits in the area. 

but "dymarka" and "smolarnia" usualy are located in the same neighborhood. You need charcoal to smelt iron, and when you make tar, there is lot of charcoal left.

 

[Alex_Da]

10 minutes ago, Lupus said:

I don't think there are any deposits in the area

 

I'm not sure about the past centuries, but a limestone deposit has been discovered some 100 km to the north-west from this area in the late 1980s.

[Sedco Express]

In my opinion, these are old metallurgical furnaces - in polish DYMARKI

[Alex_Da]

17 minutes ago, Sedco Express said:

In my opinion, these are old metallurgical furnaces - in polish DYMARKI

Thanks for the response! I see your point. Do you have any references, where such "dymarki" are shown on the map? I was trying to find the legend for the Atlas historyczny Rzeczypospolitej Polskiej but found nothing yet.